vb.Net is very frustrating - HELP!!!!! 
Author Message
 vb.Net is very frustrating - HELP!!!!!

Hi everyone

Sorry for the long post. Hope you'll understand if you get to the end of
it<g>

I'm a .NET newbie, but with 20 year of MS Basic experience, and I'm getting
very very frustrated with this new offering. Reading other users posts, I
think I'm not alone here.

What seems logical, and relatively simple, in VB3/4/5 (& Vb-DOS for that
matter), seems to have been made complicated beyond belief. I'm sure that
what I want to do can be done simply ebough in vb.NET, and maybe I'm
approaching it from the wrong angle by thinking that "this is how I've
always done it, why can't I do it this way now!"

I know that I can do what I want to do by using FLEXGRID and the JET engine
within vb.NET, but I want to see/know if I can do it with the "new"
technology.

My Applications are 100% MS Access Databases with a VB front end. At the
start of my VB experience I used bound controls. Boy oh boy, this was
sloooowwwww!

For the past 10 years I've been using INDEXES, SEEK & UPDATE to get exactly
what I want and have avoided SQL Snapshots & Dynasets as much as possible
due to their poor performance. I live in the 2rd world and none of my
clients have been able to afford SQL Server or similar.

The only place I use SQL is within a Data Extract form where the users can
build up their own query. This can be very slow to process.

When filling in a grid I've always been setting the index, Seeking the first
record & looping through the table until the required search criteria isn't
matched any more. In the middle bit, I've been reading any other required
table on it's relevant index to obtain the correct data. I've also found
that by adding a blank row, and then explicity filling in each cell in the
row was more efficient than building up a string with tabs and then adding
it all in one go.

Due to the nature of my applications, I tend, although not always, to avoid
grid editing. The grid is used to present the user with a "filterable" list
of the data/transactions/whatever, and I keep a hidden column containing the
index which the app uses for a nnon grid update.

Again here I use Indexs, seek and UNBOUND controls. I validate all the data
when the user hits the OK button, and only when all is correct do I update
the tables. To avoid overwriting previously updated records, I have a
routine that checks and passes or rejects the changes peior to updating.

This works for me, and I have a standard build method that works for 90% of
the forms that I design.

OK, down to my frustrations.

How do I obtain the same result only using vb.NET functions?

I find myself going round and round in circles when using the help. I think
what I want is a fairly simple and standard function. It seems to me that it
is a nightmare in .NET.

DataGrids
=========

From my reading of the circular help files, I cannot manipulate the xontents
of the grid without it being connected to a data source, Is this correct? If
so, {*filter*}y stupid

Another very simple request re DataGrids.

How do I set the column width on a DataGrid to zero. With Flexgrid it's
simple grid.colwidth(ColNumber)=0.

Sorry for the rant. I want to be current. I've been using VB5 for about 6
years now and have been happy with the results - yes frustrated at times,
but have solved everything I have needed to do.

All the versions of MS Basic that I've used since the early 1980's have been
a good progression from one to the next. Each one has been richer in
features than the last, but, and this is the most important point, you
didn't have to use them until you were happy to do so. As an example, it is
only in the last year that I've started using UserControls as I had some
time on my hands and I was thinking that there must be a better way than
always reusing the same code on each form.

On my first view of Vb.NET (a week or so's effort) I seem to be of the
opinion that I'm going to have to throw away a large amount of knowledge
that I have built up over the years if I wish to use this product correctly.
I hope that I am wrong, but.........


Many Thanks for getting to this bit - I hope that you can help me

Chris James
Kampala, Uganda



Sun, 28 Nov 2004 00:50:15 GMT
 vb.Net is very frustrating - HELP!!!!!

Price of SQL Server: 0.00 USD - the MSDE version, which you had access for
in the last 3-4 years was always free and scales AT LEAST as good as MS
Access.

For 20 years (hm, definilty not with VB) you have been avoiding any upgrade
in databases - your ISAM access methods are a thing from the past, sorry.

Time for some serious re-learning.

--
Regards

Thomas Tomiczek
THONA Consulting Ltd.
(Microsoft MVP C#/.NET)


Quote:
> Hi everyone

> Sorry for the long post. Hope you'll understand if you get to the end of
> it<g>

> I'm a .NET newbie, but with 20 year of MS Basic experience, and I'm
getting
> very very frustrated with this new offering. Reading other users posts, I
> think I'm not alone here.

> What seems logical, and relatively simple, in VB3/4/5 (& Vb-DOS for that
> matter), seems to have been made complicated beyond belief. I'm sure that
> what I want to do can be done simply ebough in vb.NET, and maybe I'm
> approaching it from the wrong angle by thinking that "this is how I've
> always done it, why can't I do it this way now!"

> I know that I can do what I want to do by using FLEXGRID and the JET
engine
> within vb.NET, but I want to see/know if I can do it with the "new"
> technology.

> My Applications are 100% MS Access Databases with a VB front end. At the
> start of my VB experience I used bound controls. Boy oh boy, this was
> sloooowwwww!

> For the past 10 years I've been using INDEXES, SEEK & UPDATE to get
exactly
> what I want and have avoided SQL Snapshots & Dynasets as much as possible
> due to their poor performance. I live in the 2rd world and none of my
> clients have been able to afford SQL Server or similar.

> The only place I use SQL is within a Data Extract form where the users can
> build up their own query. This can be very slow to process.

> When filling in a grid I've always been setting the index, Seeking the
first
> record & looping through the table until the required search criteria
isn't
> matched any more. In the middle bit, I've been reading any other required
> table on it's relevant index to obtain the correct data. I've also found
> that by adding a blank row, and then explicity filling in each cell in the
> row was more efficient than building up a string with tabs and then adding
> it all in one go.

> Due to the nature of my applications, I tend, although not always, to
avoid
> grid editing. The grid is used to present the user with a "filterable"
list
> of the data/transactions/whatever, and I keep a hidden column containing
the
> index which the app uses for a nnon grid update.

> Again here I use Indexs, seek and UNBOUND controls. I validate all the
data
> when the user hits the OK button, and only when all is correct do I update
> the tables. To avoid overwriting previously updated records, I have a
> routine that checks and passes or rejects the changes peior to updating.

> This works for me, and I have a standard build method that works for 90%
of
> the forms that I design.

> OK, down to my frustrations.

> How do I obtain the same result only using vb.NET functions?

> I find myself going round and round in circles when using the help. I
think
> what I want is a fairly simple and standard function. It seems to me that
it
> is a nightmare in .NET.

> DataGrids
> =========

> From my reading of the circular help files, I cannot manipulate the
xontents
> of the grid without it being connected to a data source, Is this correct?
If
> so, {*filter*}y stupid

> Another very simple request re DataGrids.

> How do I set the column width on a DataGrid to zero. With Flexgrid it's
> simple grid.colwidth(ColNumber)=0.

> Sorry for the rant. I want to be current. I've been using VB5 for about 6
> years now and have been happy with the results - yes frustrated at times,
> but have solved everything I have needed to do.

> All the versions of MS Basic that I've used since the early 1980's have
been
> a good progression from one to the next. Each one has been richer in
> features than the last, but, and this is the most important point, you
> didn't have to use them until you were happy to do so. As an example, it
is
> only in the last year that I've started using UserControls as I had some
> time on my hands and I was thinking that there must be a better way than
> always reusing the same code on each form.

> On my first view of Vb.NET (a week or so's effort) I seem to be of the
> opinion that I'm going to have to throw away a large amount of knowledge
> that I have built up over the years if I wish to use this product
correctly.
> I hope that I am wrong, but.........


> Many Thanks for getting to this bit - I hope that you can help me

> Chris James
> Kampala, Uganda



Sun, 28 Nov 2004 01:26:16 GMT
 vb.Net is very frustrating - HELP!!!!!

Quote:
> Price of SQL Server: 0.00 USD - the MSDE version, which you had access for
> in the last 3-4 years was always free and scales AT LEAST as good as MS
> Access.

Hmmm... when every I ask about the cost of it here (Uganda), the reply is
20,000USD - little bit more than 0.00USD. This might be for the end-user
Server product though. No point in developing something for SQL server if no
users use it!!!

Quote:
> For 20 years (hm, definilty not with VB) you have been avoiding any
upgrade
> in databases - your ISAM access methods are a thing from the past, sorry.

Definately not VB. But MS-Basic on ICL DRS (what are they I hear people
asking), VB3/4/5, and yes I haven't used ISAM for ages - although I did have
a looksee at my VB-DOS (I'd forgotten I had it) a couple of months ago just
to see what I was doing then.

Quote:
> Time for some serious re-learning.

I'd agree from what I've seen so far of vb.net - groan!!!


Sun, 28 Nov 2004 02:36:53 GMT
 vb.Net is very frustrating - HELP!!!!!
MSDE is Microsoft SQL Server Desktop Edition or Microsoft Data Engine
(depends on who you ask) and is free! Regardless of name, the package is
free and is very powerful. Here is the url for features supported:

http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/default.asp?url=/library/en-us/arch...
ar_ts_1cdv.asp

Here is another article that discusses when to use Jet vs MSDE

http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/default.asp?url=/library/en-us/dnms...

And here is the final skinny on cost: (Quoted directly from MS site)

Cost
MSDE is available to any licensed customer of Office 2000 Professional, 2000
Premium edition, or any Visual Studio 6.0 Enterprise or Professional edition
tool, including:

  a.. Visual Studio 6.0, Professional and Enterprise editions.
  b.. Visual Basic 6.0, Professional and Enterprise editions.
  c.. Visual C++? 6.0, Professional and Enterprise editions.
  d.. Visual InterDevT 6.0 Professional edition.
  e.. Visual J++? 6.0, Professional edition.
  f.. Visual FoxPro? 6.0 Professional edition.
Developers that build desktop and shared database solutions using MSDE may
distribute their applications royalty-free, provided that the developer of
an MSDE solution is licensed for the following products:

  a.. Microsoft Office 2000 Developer.
  b.. Any Microsoft Visual Studio 6.0 Professional or Enterprise tool (as
listed above).

So dump Access and welcome to the world of SQL!!!

Sean Fullerton
MCSE, MCT


Quote:
> > Price of SQL Server: 0.00 USD - the MSDE version, which you had access
for
> > in the last 3-4 years was always free and scales AT LEAST as good as MS
> > Access.

> Hmmm... when every I ask about the cost of it here (Uganda), the reply is
> 20,000USD - little bit more than 0.00USD. This might be for the end-user
> Server product though. No point in developing something for SQL server if
no
> users use it!!!

> > For 20 years (hm, definilty not with VB) you have been avoiding any
> upgrade
> > in databases - your ISAM access methods are a thing from the past,
sorry.

> Definately not VB. But MS-Basic on ICL DRS (what are they I hear people
> asking), VB3/4/5, and yes I haven't used ISAM for ages - although I did
have
> a looksee at my VB-DOS (I'd forgotten I had it) a couple of months ago
just
> to see what I was doing then.

> > Time for some serious re-learning.

> I'd agree from what I've seen so far of vb.net - groan!!!



Sun, 28 Nov 2004 11:04:02 GMT
 vb.Net is very frustrating - HELP!!!!!
Hi Sean

I guess that I didn't RTFM!!!!

Have been using vb5 for the past few years. Just bought vb6 along with
vb.NET as the book with .NEt said that I had to upgrade to vb6 before
upgrading to vb.NET. Now I find that the version I bought of vb.NET
(standard) doesn't allow you to import vb6,

Spent the day exploring the stuff that came with vb6 and there it is MSDE &
SQL7. Now that I've finally managed to get SQL loaded (after having to
reinstall XP Pro), vb.NET won't allow me to connect to it - not allowed in
this version.

I've also got Office XP Pro which has MSDE2K. But trying to load this (after
SQL7) says that the instance is duplicated (or something similar).

Now as I have just upgraded from XP Home to XP Pro (one week ago) so that I
can install IIS, I guess that I'm going to have to start afresh with a clean
install (there goes another of my activation counts - 2 XP Homes, 1 XP Pro
and 2 Office XPs - guess I'm going to be on the phone to MS pretty soon).
Any advice on install orders would be welcome. Should I go back to W98 and
install some stuff there before going to XP, or should I just redo XP in
another partition?

Chris



Mon, 29 Nov 2004 02:23:47 GMT
 vb.Net is very frustrating - HELP!!!!!

Chris,

I'm not sure what you mean when you say your attempt to connect to MSDE was
"not allowed" by your Standard Edition copy of Visual Basic. Did you get a
login error message? VB.Net Standard certainly does support MSDE.

http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/default.asp?url=/library/en-us/vbco...
vbgrfVisualBasicStandardEditionFeatures.asp

You can also install SQL Server 2000 as a named instance without removing
your "default instance" of SQL 7.0 (MSDE 1.0). However you'll need to
choose that option, to create a named instance, during the install.  (There
may be a limitation on MSDE that's not in the full SQL Server product that
I'm more familiar with, but I would expect it to work the same way.)

FYI, the Developer edition of SQL Server 2000 currently lists for $456.99
US on Amazon.com. This is actually the full Enterprise Edition with
different licensing restrictions.

Best wishes,

-Doug

This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no rights.

Are you secure? For information about the Microsoft Strategic Technology
Protection Program and to order your FREE Security Tool Kit, please visit
http://www.microsoft.com/security.



Mon, 29 Nov 2004 04:30:31 GMT
 vb.Net is very frustrating - HELP!!!!!
you just need to install the different versions of MSDE/SQL7 as different
instances
I have MSDE, SQL7 and SQL2K all running at the same time


Quote:
> Hi Sean

> I guess that I didn't RTFM!!!!

> Have been using vb5 for the past few years. Just bought vb6 along with
> vb.NET as the book with .NEt said that I had to upgrade to vb6 before
> upgrading to vb.NET. Now I find that the version I bought of vb.NET
> (standard) doesn't allow you to import vb6,

> Spent the day exploring the stuff that came with vb6 and there it is MSDE
&
> SQL7. Now that I've finally managed to get SQL loaded (after having to
> reinstall XP Pro), vb.NET won't allow me to connect to it - not allowed in
> this version.

> I've also got Office XP Pro which has MSDE2K. But trying to load this
(after
> SQL7) says that the instance is duplicated (or something similar).

> Now as I have just upgraded from XP Home to XP Pro (one week ago) so that
I
> can install IIS, I guess that I'm going to have to start afresh with a
clean
> install (there goes another of my activation counts - 2 XP Homes, 1 XP Pro
> and 2 Office XPs - guess I'm going to be on the phone to MS pretty soon).
> Any advice on install orders would be welcome. Should I go back to W98 and
> install some stuff there before going to XP, or should I just redo XP in
> another partition?

> Chris



Mon, 29 Nov 2004 07:05:35 GMT
 vb.Net is very frustrating - HELP!!!!!

Quote:
> Hi everyone

> Sorry for the long post. Hope you'll understand if you get to the end of
> it<g>

I got there...(;

I think you need to take some time to learn object-oriented concepts. You're
probably like me in that I had always been a top-down programmer and then
functional. Objects, up until a few years ago, left me crying.

But there is hope. I would recommend a book that is not .NET. Bruce Eckel's
"Thinking in Java" is available for free at http://www.bruceeckel.com and
it's very thorough. You might be working in VB.NET or C# with .NET, but the
conceptual aspects of java and .net are essentially the same and this book,
through chapter 8 or so, will give you an excellent review of
object-oriented development.

Then the hard part. You're going to have to write a lot of code. I've been
writing OO type code now for about 4 years and not even in a business
language. I started using a game-development language and then started
playing with traditional OO languages.

You can probably muddle through vb.net without a review of OO, but it would
help a great deal I think. As for using the database tools that you're
using, the MSDE database comes with VS.NET and that's probably a good place
to start. Access works fine too. If you're building small systems with no
need to scale, then these tools are more than adequate.

Good luck,

David C



Mon, 29 Nov 2004 14:05:11 GMT
 vb.Net is very frustrating - HELP!!!!!
Chris, lots of comments inside...

--
Regards

Thomas Tomiczek
THONA Consulting Ltd.
(Microsoft MVP C#/.NET)


Quote:
> Hi Sean

> I guess that I didn't RTFM!!!!

Get some good books - there are a good amount of very good books already.

Quote:
> Have been using vb5 for the past few years. Just bought vb6 along with
> vb.NET as the book with .NEt said that I had to upgrade to vb6 before
> upgrading to vb.NET. Now I find that the version I bought of vb.NET
> (standard) doesn't allow you to import vb6,

> Spent the day exploring the stuff that came with vb6 and there it is MSDE
&
> SQL7. Now that I've finally managed to get SQL loaded (after having to
> reinstall XP Pro), vb.NET won't allow me to connect to it - not allowed in
> this version.

WRONG. That is an error message due to a config thing you need to change in
the SQL Server, propably. Can you at least post the error message if you
want help? thats very hlpfull, you know. Right now you make the imparession
of just wanting to get rid of your gfeelings and not really loooking for
help.

Quote:
> I've also got Office XP Pro which has MSDE2K. But trying to load this
(after
> SQL7) says that the instance is duplicated (or something similar).

Sure. if you already installed the MSDE2k, then it is already installed. And
"or something similar" is not a defined error message. PLEASE:

Quote:
> Now as I have just upgraded from XP Home to XP Pro (one week ago) so that
I
> can install IIS, I guess that I'm going to have to start afresh with a
clean
> install (there goes another of my activation counts - 2 XP Homes, 1 XP Pro
> and 2 Office XPs - guess I'm going to be on the phone to MS pretty soon).

You said you RTFM? As your hardware profile has not changed, you are
re-activated on an existing activation. Means you have active the following
now:
(a) 1 XP Home
(b) 1 XP Pro
(c) propably 2 Office XP (onceon home, once on prof).

After reinstall the same should still be true.

Quote:
> Any advice on install orders would be welcome. Should I go back to W98 and
> install some stuff there before going to XP, or should I just redo XP in
> another partition?

KILL 98 TOTALLY. Get rid of the crap. Get professional.

Install XP and go. I have not seen a 98 outside our test lab for years now.

Thomas



Mon, 29 Nov 2004 14:06:56 GMT
 vb.Net is very frustrating - HELP!!!!!
Right, I overlooked this.

YOu need to install MSDE 2000 - not MSDE 7.0. The one coming with VS.NET.

--
Regards

Thomas Tomiczek
THONA Consulting Ltd.
(Microsoft MVP C#/.NET)



Quote:
> you just need to install the different versions of MSDE/SQL7 as different
> instances
> I have MSDE, SQL7 and SQL2K all running at the same time



> > Hi Sean

> > I guess that I didn't RTFM!!!!

> > Have been using vb5 for the past few years. Just bought vb6 along with
> > vb.NET as the book with .NEt said that I had to upgrade to vb6 before
> > upgrading to vb.NET. Now I find that the version I bought of vb.NET
> > (standard) doesn't allow you to import vb6,

> > Spent the day exploring the stuff that came with vb6 and there it is
MSDE
> &
> > SQL7. Now that I've finally managed to get SQL loaded (after having to
> > reinstall XP Pro), vb.NET won't allow me to connect to it - not allowed
in
> > this version.

> > I've also got Office XP Pro which has MSDE2K. But trying to load this
> (after
> > SQL7) says that the instance is duplicated (or something similar).

> > Now as I have just upgraded from XP Home to XP Pro (one week ago) so
that
> I
> > can install IIS, I guess that I'm going to have to start afresh with a
> clean
> > install (there goes another of my activation counts - 2 XP Homes, 1 XP
Pro
> > and 2 Office XPs - guess I'm going to be on the phone to MS pretty
soon).
> > Any advice on install orders would be welcome. Should I go back to W98
and
> > install some stuff there before going to XP, or should I just redo XP in
> > another partition?

> > Chris



Mon, 29 Nov 2004 14:07:22 GMT
 vb.Net is very frustrating - HELP!!!!!
Thomas

I've got everything up and running now - took 4 reinstalls of XP Pro to get
the install order right - although WinTV keeps crapping out, and I got a
funny blue screen on shutdown when I was almost there the 3rd time, {*filter*}y
annoying!!! Would have relpied earlier, but the reinstalls took a few days!

Have replied to your comments in-line

Quote:
> > I guess that I didn't RTFM!!!!

> Get some good books - there are a good amount of very good books already.

Just stuck the disk that came with VB6 and installed what was there.
Whoops - big mistake there.

An MS book actually came with the version of .NET I bought, and it is so
misleading. As an aside, I have never needed a book in the past for VB,
knowledge of the previous version allowed immediate productive work in the
latest version. This DOES NOT APPLY now.

Quote:
> > Have been using vb5 for the past few years. Just bought vb6 along with
> > vb.NET as the book with .NEt said that I had to upgrade to vb6 before
> > upgrading to vb.NET. Now I find that the version I bought of vb.NET
> > (standard) doesn't allow you to import vb6,

> > Spent the day exploring the stuff that came with vb6 and there it is
MSDE
> &
> > SQL7. Now that I've finally managed to get SQL loaded (after having to
> > reinstall XP Pro), vb.NET won't allow me to connect to it - not allowed
in
> > this version.

> WRONG. That is an error message due to a config thing you need to change
in
> the SQL Server, propably. Can you at least post the error message if you
> want help? thats very hlpfull, you know. Right now you make the
imparession
> of just wanting to get rid of your gfeelings and not really loooking for
> help.

Yup, sorted this out. Can connect. Originally I was installing the full
version NOT MSDE vb.NET STD doesn't allow connections to the full version -
so I've been informed in another newsgroup.

To be honest, I'm not impressed with .NET yet. I want to get to grips with
it, but as the title of this post says, it is frustrating - at least to me
it is.

Quote:
> > I've also got Office XP Pro which has MSDE2K. But trying to load this
> (after
> > SQL7) says that the instance is duplicated (or something similar).

> Sure. if you already installed the MSDE2k, then it is already installed.
And
> "or something similar" is not a defined error message. PLEASE:

No, I'd installed the version that came with VB6. Didn't actually realise
that the 2K version came with Office XP Pro until I looked at the disk.

- Show quoted text -

Quote:
> > Now as I have just upgraded from XP Home to XP Pro (one week ago) so
that
> I
> > can install IIS, I guess that I'm going to have to start afresh with a
> clean
> > install (there goes another of my activation counts - 2 XP Homes, 1 XP
Pro
> > and 2 Office XPs - guess I'm going to be on the phone to MS pretty
soon).

> You said you RTFM? As your hardware profile has not changed, you are
> re-activated on an existing activation. Means you have active the
following
> now:
> (a) 1 XP Home
> (b) 1 XP Pro
> (c) propably 2 Office XP (onceon home, once on prof).

I have changed my hardware profile since XP Home, and I had to reinstall
Home afresh once. Yes I installed Office on Both, and now I'm only running
Pro.

MS in East Africa is telling their OEM suppliers that ONLY three activations
are allowed/ I guess that I should have taken this with a pinch of salt as
they also "informed me" that I should but VB.NET Std rather than VS.NET Pro.

On all my reinstalls I didn't reactivate anything until I was totally happy
with the installation - today - rather than activating the installation as
soon as I made it.

Do you know if there is any way of finding out the activation status? This
is a concern as I was in the habit of reinstalling previous Windows versions
at least once a year to "clean everything up".

Quote:
> > Any advice on install orders would be welcome. Should I go back to W98
and
> > install some stuff there before going to XP, or should I just redo XP in
> > another partition?

> KILL 98 TOTALLY. Get rid of the crap. Get professional.

> Install XP and go. I have not seen a 98 outside our test lab for years

now.

Come out here then. I live in Uganda. Win95 is still being installed on some
new machines here. Win98 is the most common. Some OEM's here are refusing to
install XP until at least the first service pack - although this might be to
do with a licencing issue, as they don't "have" to supply the CD with Win98,
just stick it in /Options/Cabs. I still see WP5.1/DOS very occasionally.



Fri, 03 Dec 2004 01:41:31 GMT
 vb.Net is very frustrating - HELP!!!!!
David

Thanks for the encouragement.

The {*filter*}y frustrating part is that I feel that I cannot be productive "out
of the box". This has never happened before.

DataGrid is driving be barmy. I'll give you an example.

I'm currently writing a Tracking System for railway locomotives. The master
table has 20 fields (with cross references to other tables, such as
Manufacturer, Loco Class, Status etc.)

I want to display the basic info in a Grid, with each row having a unique
identifier LOCO ID. I want to hide the column containing the ID. When the
user double clicks on the row, a sub form appears with all the details of
the Loco, plus Status History, Components fitted etc.

How do I hide the column? In previous versions it was simple.
Grid.ColWidth(x)=0 or similar. (At this stage of my learing process, I'm not
actually sure how I reference the row I'm clicking", but I'm sure that is
there somewhere in the Help)

I KNOW that I can use FlexGrid or MSHFlexGrid, but surely this defeats the
object of .NET?

Chris



Fri, 03 Dec 2004 01:58:26 GMT
 vb.Net is very frustrating - HELP!!!!!
Hm, inline...

--
Regards

Thomas Tomiczek
THONA Consulting Ltd.
(Microsoft MVP C#/.NET)


Quote:
> Thomas

> I've got everything up and running now - took 4 reinstalls of XP Pro to
get
> the install order right - although WinTV keeps crapping out, and I got a

WinTV is a piece of v{*filter*}- get rid of this. Hauppage never really supported
it's products, sadly.

Quote:
> funny blue screen on shutdown when I was almost there the 3rd time, {*filter*}y
> annoying!!! Would have relpied earlier, but the reinstalls took a few
days!

> Have replied to your comments in-line

> > > I guess that I didn't RTFM!!!!

> > Get some good books - there are a good amount of very good books
already.

> Just stuck the disk that came with VB6 and installed what was there.
> Whoops - big mistake there.

> An MS book actually came with the version of .NET I bought, and it is so
> misleading. As an aside, I have never needed a book in the past for VB,
> knowledge of the previous version allowed immediate productive work in the
> latest version. This DOES NOT APPLY now.

No. VS.NET is now a fully object oriented language. Just a question - do you
earn money with programming? I mean, "never had to read the manual" sounds
so much like a student wannabee that it really hurts. I made it a rule
ALWAYS to read the manual for new products. Always to read the language
specification.

Quote:
> > > Have been using vb5 for the past few years. Just bought vb6 along with
> > > vb.NET as the book with .NEt said that I had to upgrade to vb6 before
> > > upgrading to vb.NET. Now I find that the version I bought of vb.NET
> > > (standard) doesn't allow you to import vb6,

Which is normal - the standard editions are not really targeting
professional use.

Quote:
> > > Spent the day exploring the stuff that came with vb6 and there it is
> MSDE

Isn't it fun that there is so much stuff that you would have seen the first
time you read the manual?

- Show quoted text -

Quote:
> > &
> > > SQL7. Now that I've finally managed to get SQL loaded (after having to
> > > reinstall XP Pro), vb.NET won't allow me to connect to it - not
allowed
> in
> > > this version.

> > WRONG. That is an error message due to a config thing you need to change
> in
> > the SQL Server, propably. Can you at least post the error message if you
> > want help? thats very hlpfull, you know. Right now you make the
> imparession
> > of just wanting to get rid of your gfeelings and not really loooking for
> > help.

> Yup, sorted this out. Can connect. Originally I was installing the full
> version NOT MSDE vb.NET STD doesn't allow connections to the full
version -
> so I've been informed in another newsgroup.

See.

Quote:
> To be honest, I'm not impressed with .NET yet. I want to get to grips with
> it, but as the title of this post says, it is frustrating - at least to me
> it is.

Then get yourself some programming introduction course. Srry if this sounds
sarcastc, but you are propably that much fixed on how things were done in
the ways of VB 1-6 that you have totally forgotten your experience with
other programming languages. You became what I call a VB Drone - someone who
defines programming by his experience of VB alone, fixing on the product,
not having more than clues of what is going on in programming and software
development if it does not appeal to VB. That is a behavior you find
normally with people without training who were so unlucky never to have to
deal with another programming language. And it sucks. If you would apply for
a job with our company you would propably be rejected just by looking at the
languages you have USED in the last 5 years as there will be no indication
of really knowing what is around right now.

Quote:
> > > I've also got Office XP Pro which has MSDE2K. But trying to load this
> > (after
> > > SQL7) says that the instance is duplicated (or something similar).

> > Sure. if you already installed the MSDE2k, then it is already installed.
> And
> > "or something similar" is not a defined error message. PLEASE:

> No, I'd installed the version that came with VB6. Didn't actually realise
> that the 2K version came with Office XP Pro until I looked at the disk.

Hm, did I talk about reading the manual?

- Show quoted text -

Quote:
> > > Now as I have just upgraded from XP Home to XP Pro (one week ago) so
> that
> > I
> > > can install IIS, I guess that I'm going to have to start afresh with a
> > clean
> > > install (there goes another of my activation counts - 2 XP Homes, 1 XP
> Pro
> > > and 2 Office XPs - guess I'm going to be on the phone to MS pretty
> soon).

> > You said you RTFM? As your hardware profile has not changed, you are
> > re-activated on an existing activation. Means you have active the
> following
> > now:
> > (a) 1 XP Home
> > (b) 1 XP Pro
> > (c) propably 2 Office XP (onceon home, once on prof).

> I have changed my hardware profile since XP Home, and I had to reinstall
> Home afresh once. Yes I installed Office on Both, and now I'm only running
> Pro.

And the activations dont count as new.

Quote:
> MS in East Africa is telling their OEM suppliers that ONLY three
activations
> are allowed/ I guess that I should have taken this with a pinch of salt as
> they also "informed me" that I should but VB.NET Std rather than VS.NET

Pro.

No. 3 activations - but "repeating activations" do not count. This is fully
documented by MS, you just have to read the manual.

Quote:
> On all my reinstalls I didn't reactivate anything until I was totally
happy
> with the installation - today - rather than activating the installation as
> soon as I made it.

> Do you know if there is any way of finding out the activation status? This
> is a concern as I was in the habit of reinstalling previous Windows
versions
> at least once a year to "clean everything up".

Again, maybe you start reading the manuals at one point. As long as your
hardware status does not change, the activation counts against an existing
one. And, IMHO, they are deleted after 180 days. Start using the MS website
search function.

- Show quoted text -

Quote:
> > > Any advice on install orders would be welcome. Should I go back to W98
> and
> > > install some stuff there before going to XP, or should I just redo XP
in
> > > another partition?

> > KILL 98 TOTALLY. Get rid of the crap. Get professional.

> > Install XP and go. I have not seen a 98 outside our test lab for years
> now.

> Come out here then. I live in Uganda. Win95 is still being installed on
some
> new machines here. Win98 is the most common. Some OEM's here are refusing
to
> install XP until at least the first service pack - although this might be
to
> do with a licencing issue, as they don't "have" to supply the CD with
Win98,
> just stick it in /Options/Cabs. I still see WP5.1/DOS very occasionally.

Well, but you consider yourself to be a develoer, right? Surely there is a
ton of 95/98 around here in germany too. But NOT on professional developer
desks. As I said - not seen for a long time outside our test lab. We make
regression tests etc., but why the **** should I develop on a system
intended for end users? MS has advised against this for years, but t ilooks
like you have to read some websites to get this message.

Thomas



Fri, 03 Dec 2004 13:00:33 GMT
 vb.Net is very frustrating - HELP!!!!!
Get yourself a good datagrid, maybe from Devexpress
( http://www.***.com/ ). The onex MS supplies ar extrmely basic - the
flexgrid os pretty basic, too, btw.

And the nit finally is time to get some theory, or? Like reading the
manuals.

--
Regards

Thomas Tomiczek
THONA Consulting Ltd.
(Microsoft MVP C#/.NET)


Quote:
> David

> Thanks for the encouragement.

> The {*filter*}y frustrating part is that I feel that I cannot be productive
"out
> of the box". This has never happened before.

> DataGrid is driving be barmy. I'll give you an example.

> I'm currently writing a Tracking System for railway locomotives. The
master
> table has 20 fields (with cross references to other tables, such as
> Manufacturer, Loco Class, Status etc.)

> I want to display the basic info in a Grid, with each row having a unique
> identifier LOCO ID. I want to hide the column containing the ID. When the
> user double clicks on the row, a sub form appears with all the details of
> the Loco, plus Status History, Components fitted etc.

> How do I hide the column? In previous versions it was simple.
> Grid.ColWidth(x)=0 or similar. (At this stage of my learing process, I'm
not
> actually sure how I reference the row I'm clicking", but I'm sure that is
> there somewhere in the Help)

> I KNOW that I can use FlexGrid or MSHFlexGrid, but surely this defeats the
> object of .NET?

> Chris



Fri, 03 Dec 2004 13:02:41 GMT
 
 [ 14 post ] 

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